This transcript is auto-generated and may contain errors.
0:19 All right, I will say good morning. I think this might be about the time. Is that possible? Good morning. Good morning. Let us begin begin by thanking all of our sponsors for this morning's sure to thank our total sponsors for and it's coming back on in just a second. Good. For for the month of time Look at that. Look at that. Look at that. 0:40 For the month of Tammuz by Lena Latova, Yona and Yona and Abby Ram. Thank you for dedicating all the Sherman Josh was this month for a full Sherman before Eliezer Ben Elisheva. As well as Daniel and Michelle by Pablo Vertso for the third yard sale from Vate Vraha, Ben Yehuda Ariye. 0:59 Our doctor only sponsors for today, Alan and Sherry Steinberg in the schools of continued health and life for Hanov by Shushan from ultimate for and in the evening as a school for a full Sherman for Shlomo's father, Haim Mordechai Ben Hava. We hope that in the merit of our total all the and all the families in the home all those who need a full Sherman together with call holy Israel. 1:22 Shmira and Hashkacha upon our brothers and sisters in Israel and all our holy soldiers to be successful and I say to them Close with that, let us get a lot to do today but I sent out a lot on the chat last night as well. Some some of it will go through, some of it we won't go through but I'm here to tell you the journey begins again for this week right now. Let's begin. Today's is done by 52A. Let's just start right from the 1:45 top. Literally from the top of you got a few lines below that but let's just start here. All that you know I guess what is remember again at the end of yesterday that we deal with the interesting idea. Remember the sorry, the Gamara is talking about this idea of the if an animal goes ahead and falls, we have to be concerned that as a result of the fall first of all I have to welcome 2:08 Avram Plunger who is here with us today. He might be our youngest member of the Mishnah sheer Baruch Hashem with his own Gamara sitting over here. Can you imagine? Can you imagine if we were How old are you? Five and a half. Five and a half. Okay, so I'll finish off by his Bar Mitzvah. 2:27 Incredible. How about where we would have been? I should speak for where I would have been. All right, Avram who just continue to give you incredible Mishnah and Hashem should be with you and Hashem should be with you and may Hashem be with you. Amen. 2:43 Also, I forgot to mention I'm sorry. First of all, happy Father's Day. Happy Father's Day. If if you are have a father in this world, make sure that you take the time to pick up the phone and to call and to say a thank you. No parent is perfect but every parent really tries their best and every parent deserves a thank you. And if your father's not here in this world, so make sure to do something can even do something even on Father's 3:07 Day. Every day can do something so to learn a little extra, give a little extra to the fathers to the fathers ourselves. Happy Father's Day to all of you and [clears throat] to your children. Thank God they have your wives. All right, all right. It's a good good good day to reply to them. 3:26 Yesterday my some of my grandchildren were over for Shabbos and my Baltimore grandchildren my grandson Shua turned to me and he said, "Zeda, happy Mother's Day. Happy Mother's Day." I said, "Happy Mother's Day." You know, sometimes children understand you really did very little in this whole picture over here. 3:46 See, even on Father's Day I can't get happy but even on Father's Day you know on Father's Day it's a happy Mother's Day. All right. All right, anyway then so remember again, we were speaking about in the Gemara about an animal about about if the animal goes ahead and hits the ground, then we have to be concerned that perhaps again bones were broken or concussions and as a result the animal became a treif. So the Gemara is continuing along this line. Kol 4:09 hadak, if it fell on loose loose sand, lo chashin, we don't have to be concerned that anything happens to the bones of the animal. Kol hadash, but again, if it's the type of if it's type of sand that has large stones in it, then there's a concern. Avak drakhim chashinon, the dust of the literally again the the dirt of just the regular road, we are worried about. Tivna is fine. Kol avak drakhim chashinon. So again, what we'll say the idea that 4:33 we're going to see is when it when we're we have to be concerned for hard impact without any give, that's when we're concerned that maybe there was some rattling of the bones, breakage of the bones, concussions of the bones, or concussions. The Gemara says the next, tivna avad bazga chashinon, lo avad bazga lo chashin. If you have straw and the straw was made into a bundle, then we have to be concerned because then there would be some level of significant impact. If the straw was 4:57 not made into a bundle, then halakha l'ma'aseh, there's it's softer and therefore we have no concern about the impact. Chitin v'khol mineiha chashinon, wheat and anything like in the wheat family, we are choshesh. Apparently again, it is of a harder constituency or harder consistency, sorry, and therefore halakha l'ma'aseh, you have to be concerned about impact. Sa'ari v'khol mineiha chashinon, similarly again, similarly again, sa'ari 5:20 v'khol mineiha, barley and anything in that particular family, also if the bird hit against it, we're concerned. Kol minei kitniyos, ein bahem shum risukei avarim, l'vad min rubya, l'vad min rubya. So again, generally this is interesting, lentils. Let's say if a pile of lentils and the bird came crashing down on the pile of lentils, there's no concern about risukei avarim, no concern about concussions or or 5:43 significant fatal breakage. With the exception of fenugreek. So you're going to say what's the problem with lentils? So Rashi points out over here, Rashi points out that I will see we'll see the cloud in just a moment, but because lentils can't really come together in a mass. So by definition, if the bird falls down on it, there's some level of give. We're going to see the cloud good was going to be that when the bird falls on something and there's no 6:07 give on the item that it's falling onto, that's when we have to be concerned for what we call resuk avarin. Fatal breakage or concussions. But where there's give, where there's give, that softens the blow and we don't have to be concerned for resuk avarin. 6:23 Good. Kimsi in bomishum resuk avarin chefsi yesh bomishum resuk avarin klov ademilso. We'll say here is the rule. Komidi demashrik in bomishum resuk avarin. Anything I will say if you look at Rashi, kol demashrik Rashi says or Rashi means that Rashi has it demishtarik. Maklik zemiza veina nibashim yakha. So any items ultimately 6:46 again that literally means slip away from each other and they do not form together into a mass. Therefore the Gemara says in that case in bomi in bomishum resuk avarin. So komidi demashrik, sorry kol demilso komidi demashrik in bomishum resuk avarin. So if the items if the items do not stick together in one mass, but ultimately move when they have when the item comes in impact with them, there's 7:11 no resuk avarin. Lo mashrik, but if it does not give or if it could form yesh bomishum resuk avarin. Ultimately again there is a concern about concussion or fatal breakage. So you're going to say really really quite really quite an interesting idea. So alokha lemaise any time now this is talking about over here, this is dako referring to birds, but by pashlus the same logic applies to animals as well. So if the bird goes 7:35 ahead and hits against something that is a solid mass and therefore there's no give, that's when we have to be concerned about fatal breakage and concussions. However, if it hits against something which has a give, does doesn't coalesce as a mass, we don't have to be concerned ultimately again about fatal breakage or concussions. 7:55 Incredible. Dovok. So, what's saying now this is an interesting case. Look at that. She dovok. We're talking also the dark cotton the off shoken a love or mid back ball for a hammer that. So, you know what I'm saying? So, dovok means imagine for a moment you have a board and the board had some glue on it. The bird landed on the board. The bird landed on the board. So, as a result now, the bird is stuck to the board. But 8:18 interesting so So, now what happens? Now, the bird is falling attached to the board. Right? So, I guess somehow let's say let's say it was at a height it landed on something landed on something Let's do it differently. The bird perched itself at a height, but it end up landing on a on a board with glue glue board. Right? The glue whether it's a trap or something else it landed on it. Now, it falls to the ground stuck to 8:42 that board. That's the case. That's the case of dovok. So, Rav Ashi Shari Amemar Assur. So, Rav Ashi said the bird is mutar. There's no concern of risuk eivarim. And Amemar said that it's assur. So, what I'm saying let's analyze the case. Bechad gapa de choli amlo de shari. So, if the bird was only glued down attached to the board with one wing, but it had another wing that was still functional, 9:06 everyone agrees that the bird is kosher. Cuz Rav Ashi What would be the logic there? Since with the other wing it could flap, that would soften the blow. That would soften the blow and therefore we don't have to be concerned for risuk eivarim. Kiply Where's the machlokes? Betrei gapi. Machlokes is what happens if both wings got attached to the board of glue or to the glue board. Manda assur The one who says it's assur Amemar lo cha heichin ekum. So, the opinion 9:31 that says that it's assur, of course, if both wings are glued down to the board, what's there to do? How How is the bird going to go ahead and prevent itself from landing with a thud? Well, man the Shari the one who says that it's motor I'm actually the niko akivi the gapi. So interestingly enough the one who says that it's motor will say you know when a bird gets caught on a glue board see even though the wings are attached it's 9:54 usually the feathers of the wings that are attached. So like the wing joint is still movable. I don't know why I'm going like this right right right but the right but the the wing point the the right the wing joint is still is still movable and therefore I will say it could still could still manipulate itself a little bit to soften the blow. 10:11 Okay. So my speaker down here on alternative version of this is betray got me called I'm not playing with you. The also everyone agrees that I will call the mice out where the bird was attached by both wings by both wings to the glue to the glue board everyone agrees that it's going to be also. So keep playing with you where's the locus but got with one wing man the Shari I'm going to call after the park the hand gapa so the one who says that the bird is going to be motor because since the 10:35 bird could still flutter a little bit with one wing that prevents the full impact of the fall and therefore there's no reason why therefore the bird will be motor. Well, man the also the one who says that it's also came in the behind low mercy park behind no mercy park. The one who says that it's also is listen a bird flies with two wings. If it doesn't have both wings it cannot fly and if it cannot fly when it hits the ground 10:59 ultimately it's going to be impacted and it's going to result in reason why and I will say what is that betray got me also the hand gapa Shari and I will say that I will call the mice out like this. If you have a bird that gets stuck on a glue board gets stuck on a trap. If both wings get attached then I will call the mice out when that bird then hits the ground cuz remember again I will say it's not the act of getting attached to the blue to the glue board 11:23 that's problematic. What's problematic is that it falls and hits the ground. That's the case of the full law or we have to be concerned for resource volume, right? Either concussions or fatal breakage. That's our shyness. If both wings got attached, then the animal is a treif and cannot be eaten. 11:42 But with one wing, interestingly enough, one wing, we are confident that the bird is able to to sufficiently manipulate and move itself so that it softens the blow and therefore there's no issue of the food. I will say I think that there's a tremendous muscle hustle in this game as well. So I will say I think I was thinking about this late last night. 12:00 Which is there's a fascinating metaphor in this, right? What what what is this metaphor of of the bird on the glue board? I think the metaphor is like this, that of course so much of life is trying to avoid negative circumstances, right? So much of life is trying to make sure that I I don't end up on the glue board of life. That's my goal, right? 12:20 Pretty singular goal. Don't end up on the glue board of life. But sometimes you do. Right? Sometimes I find myself in circumstances, whether whether I got there because I made poor decisions or just circumstances were visited upon me. 12:35 So much of life is then about mitigating your circumstances. Damage control, right? Sometimes it is what it is. I I I I cannot get out of this. I cannot extricate myself from these circumstances. But just because you can't extricate yourself from it, doesn't mean you can't mitigate it. A lot of life is about taking bad 12:59 circumstances and just making them a little less bad or making sure that they don't get worse. And that's the outcome. I think that's the metaphor of like the bird on the glue board with one wing stuck and one wing detached, right? There's still that one wing. There's so much of life is that one wing moment. 13:20 And what are you going to do with the one one wing you have? You're right, you can't get yourself off the glue board, but you could at least prevent your circumstances from getting worse and maybe even again mitigate the damage that is going to occur. Incredible. Incredible. All right, let's go right there. The majority of the ribs So, we'll see that this is very exciting. I mean, not for the animal, but for us. All right, so so again, so now what happens 13:43 if you have an animal that ultimately again the majority of the ribs the majority of the ribs um were were broken. So, again I'm going to say if you take a look at the WhatsApp chat, it's just for a moment. I sent you a whole bunch of images over here, which are going to be which are going to be somewhat important for our discussion today. So, if you look specifically on page two of what I sent you just to show you a little bit about 14:06 how the animal rib cage is is situated. It's not that different from a human rib cage as well. So, if you notice again, the rib it's called the rib cage cuz you could see it on the second page. You'll notice again the first image on the second page, it literally looks like a cage. Right? This is you're looking let's say from an actually in this case you're looking from the back of the animal towards the front. You're staring right through the animal. You can see on 14:29 the sides of those are the ribs. The ribs are The ribs attach on the top of the spinal cord. They attach into the top of the spinal cord. Now, we'll see not the whole way. There are There are parts There is There are parts of the There are ribs that are not attached to the spinal cord and then animal we'll discuss those in just a moment. So, therefore the mission in this case >> [clears throat] >> The mission in this case is that halacha l'maaseh if you have if you have a 14:54 breakage of the animal's rib cage rov salo salo the majority of the ribs are broken, ultimately again the animal is a treifa. Now, before we go into the Gemara, take a quick look at Rashi because Rashi gives us the assumption under which we're going to operate over here. So, Rashi says it's in Rashi it says it's actually in the Divrei Hamaskil it says "Betrei gapey asur." If 15:17 you see that Rashi it's not in Divrei Hamaskil, it's just like a two dots on the end of that Rashi. Rashi says over here half base salos kedolim yesh one more. There are 22 ribs. There are 22 ribs. Now, we're going to see the animal actually has more than 22 ribs. The reason it says 22 ribs is there's 22 what we'll call primary ribs. Now, Rashi says over here 15:40 ribs that have yesh by more means it has marrow. Now, what we're going to see is what's important about those 22 ribs, those 11 on each side of the animal those are the ribs that connect into the spinal cord, the vertebrae. Spine. Spine, right? Spine. Spine. 15:58 Spine. Right? They They go ahead and they fit into the spine. So, again, 11 on each side. Now, there's more ribs than those 22, but those are the primary 22 ribs that we're going to be talking about. Yod aleph mekhan, yod aleph mekhan, verov shel ahen have a yod base. 16:14 Therefore, when the Mishnah speaks about the breakage of the of the ribs of the majority of the ribs are talking about 12 ribs. Again, the reason we're saying this is because we're going to see that there's more than 22 ribs, but 22 primary ribs that attach into the spine. 16:30 Says the Yuma, let's go inside. Turn our bun on. So, we'll say two lines from before the lines get wide after the two dots. Turn our bun on. Elohim rov slos. What does it mean the majority of the ribs? Shesh mekhan v'shesh mekhan or a had esre mekhan v'had esre mekhan. Now, we'll say we're going to see 22 primary ribs. Therefore, the majority of that is 12. So, now the Yuma just says, by the 16:52 way, we don't care if it's six on one side six on the other side or 11 on one side one on the other side. Like it does it doesn't matter to us how we get to 12. Right? The idea just is that l'ma'aseh l'ma'aseh that halacha l'ma'aseh you have 12 broken ribs. That's the majority of breakage, which will then make the animal a treifah. Am I missing 17:16 here? So, the Yuma answers what it says that that and that is that is halakha l'maaseh. So halakha l'maaseh, if an animal has 12 broken ribs, again, whether it's six and six or 11 and one, that is going to make the animal a treifa. That's fact number one. Ze'iri now adds in Amora Ze'iri "U'meichatzi'on u'meichatzi'on klappei shidra." And by the way, they have to be broken dafka 17:40 dafka on the upper part of the rib towards the spine. So, if they're all broken on the lower part of the rib, right, which goes to the under, right, the under part of the animal, that does not make them a treifa. Only if it's broken on the midpoint midpoint up towards the spine. Okay? Two very important piece of information. Amora bar Rav Huna Amora bar Rav Huna u'visala aski d'ula sheish b'moach. Furthermore, 18:03 when we're talking about the primary ribs that have marrow, which are the ribs themselves which are attached to the spine, cuz remember in animal anatomy, further back where the spine ends, you still have ribs, animal ribs that are still going on that are not attached to the spine. Amora Ulla ben Zakai Ulla ben Zakai said Amora Ulla ben Zakai sorry Amora Ulla ben Zakai amar "Nekru 18:27 b'rov tzaddai echad nishtaglu b'rosh nitzlan." So, Ulla So, Ulla comes along and says the following. He says that halakha l'maaseh "Nekru b'rov tzaddai echad." If you take a look at Rashi, Rashi says "Or nekru b'rov tzaddai echad." Rashi is about six lines up from before it gets wide. 18:45 Eight less six seven lines up. "Nekru b'rov tzaddai echad keivan she'nekru meishish meheim d'hainu rov tzaddai echad treifa." So, what we're going to see is as follows. There's a number of different things that can happen to the ribs, right? The way The way that the Mishnah started discussing is rib breakage. So, have a broken rib. That's it. Then there's what's called a nekru. Nekru again we're 19:07 going to see that the way the rib works is at the edge of the rib, there is a ball. That ball fits into a socket on the spine. That's animal anatomy. Second of all, say so you could have you could have I don't know if it's human anatomy it's human anatomy as well. Not human anatomy. Right? Yeah. Right, the machlokes over here. Machlokes, okay. 19:28 You guys do get out, right? The physical therapist and the doctor. I'm not getting in the middle of this. Right? So again, right. So I'll say so so so the gemara says like this. So nekru is a case where essentially the rib was dislodged. Dislodged. So therefore interestingly enough, the rib itself the rib itself is whole. It's not broken. It's just been detached from the spine. So the gemara 19:51 says so interestingly enough, Ulla Ulla is making this distinction. Nekru berov tzaddik echad, if halacha l'maaseh this the rib itself was detached, then halacha l'maaseh what the kind of rov tzaddik echad treifa, then even if the majority of the ribs are detached on one side, that makes the animal the animal a treifa. Nishtabru halacha l'maaseh, if it and again, even 20:14 if you only have majority of ribs on one side that make the animal a treifa, when the ribs are broken in order for the animal to become a treifa, you require two sides. Two sides. So breakage requires two sides of breakage, dislodging even only on one side. Rebbe Yochanan Rebbe Yochanan says, "No. Be nekru be nishtabru berov shnei tzaddim." Not true, Rebbe Yochanan says. Whether we're 20:37 talking about the rib is being dislodged or broken, halacha l'maaseh, you need the majority of the ribs and you also need happening on both sides. Incredible. All right, so let's analyze a bit more. Amar Rav Nekru tzela d'chulya. So Rebbe Yochanan says, "What happens if halacha l'maaseh the the rib and the vertebrae, right? 20:56 And the vertebra that it's attached to, ultimately again become dislodged, see my treifa." So Rebbe Yochanan says what he seems to be saying over here is as follows. Rav seems to be saying that if one rib along with his vertebrae, becomes detached, that'll also ultimately make it into a treif as well. 21:17 What happens if a rib on each side was was detached, but the vertebrae in the middle ultimately again remains? So, the Gemara says, "Well, what's that case?" Mahu? That would seem to be a case where the animal literally again was chopped in half. So, then again, the vertebrae the vertebrae the vertebrae would remain intact, but the two ribs would be detached. 21:39 So, Rav's also talking about a case of gistra. Kika Amar Rav, sela below chulya. So, Rav was talking about a case ultimately again of the rib, but not including the vertebrae. But, Rav said, "What about the case of a rib together with the vertebrae?" So, the Gemara says, "Sela v'chatzi chulya." What he means to say is like this, what happens in the case of where the rib was detached, but the vertebrae itself remained partially intact. There was 22:04 only part of the vertebrae that was detached or damaged. Which makes it sound like the Gemara says that Rav Kahana and Rav Assi were talking about a case of a rib without the vertebrae. But, the Gemara says, "But, Amar l'chulhu gistra kamisu." But, they said, "And that's the case where you have ribs detached, but vertebrae intact, that would seem to be like a case of gistra, where the animal 22:30 is just being halfed." But, Ulla said, "Ben Zakkai Amar, nekru." >> [clears throat] >> The Gemara says, "V'amar Ulla ben Zakkai Amar, nekru b'rov sat echad, nishtabru b'rov shnei tz'dadim." I, but again, Ulla ben Zakkai said that halacha l'maaseh again, that in the case of nekru, where the ribs were um dislodged, then that is b'rov sat echad, that is in 22:56 majority of one side, but nishtabru, where they're broken, it's the majority of two sides. Amar Rav Huna, "Sam zeh sh'lo k'neged zeh." that case is talking about ribs that are not opposite each other. Our case over here is talking about ribs that are opposite each other. I will second if you talk about the majority of two sides. 23:22 It's impossible to have rib breakage on majority of two sides without ribs that are opposite each other. That doesn't work. To which the Gamara is supposed to Hassam, this is an expression. Buchna below Assisa. Haha Buchna below Assisa. So you know what they literally Buchna below Assisa means the pestle without the mortar. So that that is a that is a metaphor for ultimately again the ball 23:46 of the rib, right? Where the ball of the rib was removed, but the vertebrae socket was left totally intact. That's the lashing of mortar and pestle. So that's talking about a case of Buchna below Assisa. Haha Buchna below Assisa. Here this case so here's where we're talking about the ball of the rib and both the socket of the vertebrae were both removed or both detached or both broken. E Hachi, that's the case kind of the Rav. That's the same case of Rav. To 24:10 which the Gamara says, "Okay, Lo Shmilu Rav." They didn't hear this ruling of Rav. I they bone minay kid Rav. So why not ask in accordance with Rav? So I will say Savar Savri le boy minay Hada de parsh lan tarte. They figured let us ask one question or that would inevitably answer two questions or let us ask about one that will shed light on two. What does this mean? The E bone 24:33 minay Hada, if you go ahead and you ask only about one rib, Haniha E amaran treifa kashikin tarte. If he paskins tarte treifa with one rib where everything is removed, then certainly again that'll be the case of two ribs. E amaran shera akati tarte me boy lan. But if he says that the removal of one rib together with the socket is still going to be kasher, that doesn't answer our question regarding two ribs. 24:58 hash the nami. So even if you ask about two ribs, how do you If fine if it's kosher by two ribs, no it's not by two ribs, it's not going to be one rib. But if we still don't know what to do in the case of one rib. So he figured in case of two ribs. 25:25 They were nervous if they would ask this question of Rav, Rav would get upset. Why would he get upset, right? Because he would say if he would answer that one is a treif, then it goes without saying that two is a treif as well. To which the Gamara says, but they asked Rav and Rav didn't get upset. 25:44 Okay, so when Rav gave that answer that one second, if the ribs are detached with the vertebrae intact, that's the case of a that was Rav's that was Rav getting angry. That that answer was a little bit of a dismissive answer. Okay, incredible. So let's go back to So before before we go on, so what what do we have? Okay, so a lot of back and forth with the ribs. So bottom line, the the part the takeaway part for us to remember is as follows. The mission 26:08 tells me that if the majority of ribs are broken, the animal is a treif. The Gamara is maintaining still maintaining that. What the Gamara has advanced to us is what's the majority? What's the what's the number? What's the majority? 12. Right, 12. Why? 26:24 Because we're operating with the 22 primary ribs which are the ones attached to the spine. Not the ribs that go further down towards the back end of the animal which are not attached to the spine. Furthermore, we adopt the position of that is only if the breakage is from the midpoint of the rib and above, right? 26:40 Towards the spinal area. Below that area, that will not make the animal a treif. And also for our purposes, we don't really distinguish between whether the ribs are broken or [clears throat] whether they're detached. Hello so we'll use the same metric of majority of the ribs and ultimately again from from the midpoint and on. Okay, incredible. 27:08 So what's actually interesting is if the rib was attached she says a feelable sisa. So which means if the rib was if the rib was detached even without the vertebra, right? Even if without the vertebra. or a skull or a skull that was crushed in its majority or a or the or the the the flesh that that that surrounds the carcass. I will say 27:36 the carcass is one of the stomachs called the paunch, right? Of the animal. So if the meat around the carcass is we'll see what it means in its majority. Traifa. In all of these cases the animal is a traifa. So the said three things. Number one, a detached rib, right? Number two, a skull that is crushed in its majority. And if the flesh around the carcass is split, whatever that we'll see what that means 28:00 in just a moment. In all three of these things the animal is a traifa. So the says selah mekarah traifa. Nekrah selah mekarah traifa. Is that true? If the rib is detached >> [clears throat] >> even below even without the vertebrae, then it's going to be traifa. Or maybe the akasha. 28:18 Is akasha base. Kama he saw beshadra. So I will say how much Now now remember we're switching gears we saw this already before. This statement of kama he saw beshadra how much has to be missing from the vertebrae has nothing to do with animals. This now we are transitioning to a new topic which is tumas ohel. Remember again we've established this. What's tumas ohel? You have a person a dead body inside a corpse inside of a house 28:43 underneath a roof. If the corpse if you are under the same roof as that corpse, what happens? You become tummy. That's called Thomas Ohel. That's called Thomas Ohel. Now, again, normally the corpse has to be fully intact. There are other exceptions to this. You have a full skeleton, or even if you have a full skeleton, but you have certain parts of the body which are fully intact. Amongst those things, a spinal column. If you have a complete spinal column, that 29:07 could convey Thomas Ohel. So, now the Gemara asks, how much of the spinal column could be deficient and yet still transmit Thomas Ohel? I guess another way of saying it is, at what point in time is the spinal spinal column deficient that it no no longer transmits Thomas Ohel? So, Kamachi Sambish Adra, how much of the spinal 29:31 column has to be has to be missing so that it no longer transmits Thomas Ohel? The Sham Shamai says, Sh'tei Chulyos, two vertebrae. Two vertebrae. If it's missing two vertebrae, it's deficient. And if it's deficient, it no longer transmits Thomas Ohel. Or Beis Shammai Beis Hillel says, Chulyah Achas, ultimately again, one one vertebrae. 29:51 V'amrei Rebbi Yehudah ben Shmuel, and Rebbi Yehudah ben Shmuel, that the same Machlokes was the same Machlokes as Bechein u'Treifah. The same applies to Treifah. So, in other words, these Shitos of Beis Shammai Beis Hillel will also So, Beis Shammai will say, when does an animal become a Treifah? If it's missing two vertebrae. When does Hillel hold that it becomes a Treifah? If it's missing one vertebrae. Bechein u'Treifah. So, the Gemara says, So, what 30:15 does it say? So, the point is, what what do you see from here? So, what does it say? Chacha, Tzelah belo Chulyah. So, again, I want to say, here he's talking about a case of the rib again without the vertebrae. Chasam Chulyah belo Tzelah. There he's talking about the vertebrae without the rib. Even if it's just missing So, the Gemara says, Bish'ta u'Tzelah belo Chulyah Mish'kach Asur. So, I understand the case where the animal can be missing the rib without the vertebrae. Yeah, because you 30:39 could have that. You could have a case where the rib is gone, but the vertebrae is still intact. Ela Chulyah belo But again, how [clears throat] do you have a case of the holy without the seller? So my says Mash the Shulhi Kofli. Oh, there's a very easy way ultimately again to have the vertebrae without the seller. How do 31:01 you have that? The Shulhi Kofli the Shulhi Kofli yesh holyos besh shantslos. So ultimately again, there's many vertebrae that don't have that don't have ribs attached them, right? Because the spinal column extends extends the spine extends further down and therefore without any attached ribs. Okay? 31:20 Maskipler ser says something different. But listen to me and one second. This should be included in the list of the coolos of besh shamai and the coolos of bes right? After all again I will say interestingly enough remember besh shamai holds that an animal does not become a treif unless of course it's what? Missing two vertebrae. Bes says 31:43 one. So what do you see from here? Bes is mach besh shamai is makeo. So why not include this in the list cuz there is a short list of the coolos of bes the coolos of besh shamai to which the says no no no I'm rav kish tuma is shol davi besh shamai no no no because remember what was the context of the question? The context of the question interestingly enough was asked 32:07 in regard to tumas ohel. Right? So remember again I will say So remember in tumas ohel what's the question? The question is at what point in time does a spinal column stop conveying tumas ohel? In that case besh shamai says only once it's missing two vertebrae. Bes says it's missing one. In that case besh shamai is still the mach and bes is the makeo, right? Because 32:31 besh shamai will say it continues to convey tuma until the point that it's missing two. Beis Hillel says it stops conveying tumah once it's missing one. So, from that perspective, from that perspective, since since the topic over here is possible, since the topic over here is tumas ohel, Beis Shammai is still the machmir and Beis Hillel is the meikel. Yes, it happens to be 32:54 interestingly enough that the other application of this does happen to indicate that Beis Shammai is the meikel and Beis Hillel is the machmir because Beis Shammai will say that a halachic mindset animal only becomes a treifah ultimately again when it's missing two vertebrae. Beis Hillel says even one, but that's not the topic of the braisa. 33:10 The topic of the braisa Excuse [clears throat] me, the topic of the mishna, I should say, is actual tumas ohel, not treifus. Okay, incredible what I'm saying, incredible. The Gemara asks a side question now. The gulgolesh Remember again, in the braisa Excuse me, in the braisa that the Gemara quoted on the bottom of nun beis amud aleph, so the Gemara asked over here or 33:33 the Gemara stated Rabba bar Rav Sherira was said in the name of Rav Nachman who said in the name of Shmuel. First case was the rib case, second case was a skull of an animal, right? The skull of an animal who um gulgolesh besavru a skull which was crushed in its majority ultimately renders the animal a treifah. So, now the Gemara just asks a shailah. The 33:56 gulgolesh besavru boy Rav Yirmiyah I would say ayin mem nun beis amud beis, 52b two four six eight 10 11 lines down from the top. Boy Rav Yirmiyah, rov golpah or rov akei'fah? What are we talking about over here? I would say just to illustrate this, take a look on the on the WhatsApp chat for just a moment so you could see this is this taken right out of the ArtScroll, page five. Page five on the document I sent 34:21 you. Here's the shailah. What what are we talking about over here? Are we talking about the rov golpah, what we call the majority of the height? That's the that's the picture on the left, which you can see essentially is like the top part of the skull, or do we see rova kava, the majority of the circumference? Again, I will say. So again, picture on the left, but they have over here the blue line, that's the majority of the height, or picture on 34:45 the right, the circumference. So which one is it? When we say aloha aloha I said that the majority of the skull is crushed, is it the majority of the height, the majority of the circumference? The amora says, "Teko." Teko. Okay. Basha and Rova Keres Peruva. So we actually we actually had a lot of this discussion already on Friday, Thursday, Friday of last week. So again, the amora said 35:09 it's the flesh surrounding the majority of the keres, right? Is is cut, it's perforated, but that makes the animal a treifa. So boy Rova Ashi, "Berov karua karua or berov natul?" So when we say that if the flesh of the majority of the flesh around the keres, keres the paunch, one of the stomachs of the animal, is something happens to it, that the animal is a treifa. What what exactly happened? Are we talking about 35:32 that the majority of the flesh around the stomach is cut is cut or it's missing? Which one? So Tifser Leminisam. So we'll say so let's analyze the space what we saw in the mishna. What do we see in the mishna? And I will say that isn't it incredible? Just you should remember again, it feels I know like we've been doing all the treifas for about like 4 and 1/2 years. I I just want to point out, remember all of this is one mishna. 35:54 We have not had a second mishna in this perek yet. All of this is just this one mishna. So what do we learn in that mishna? No, keres hapenimis shinikva. Remember again what we said, we had this one a lot of time of this. The inner keres, the inner paunch. >> [clears throat and cough] >> Keres hapenimis that was perforated or shinikra rova itzola. So again I will say. So remember again we made this distinction between the inner keres and 36:20 the outer keres. The inner keres, if it's perforated, that makes the animal into a treifah. The outer karash, right? Osh Nikrah Rovah Itzona. If the outer karash is Nik, now Nikrah literally means it's torn, right? It's cut open. Ultimately, again, that'll make it a treifah. 36:45 Again, I will say, when we speak about the karash hapnimi, the inner paunch, that's the entire stomach. The entire stomach is called the inner karash hapnimi. So, what is the outer paunch? The Gemara says, "Bassar ha'chofeh es rov ha'karash." That word actually refers to the flesh which covers the outer stomach. So, the Gemara says, "Midei hu ta'ama el el Shmuel." So, this whole discussion is only for Shmuel. 37:11 Okay, Rabbi Yaakov bar Nachmani um Shmuel, makom she'ein bam milas. Ultimately, again, we're not supposed to have this before as well. That according to Shmuel, what's the definition, ultimately again, of the inner karash? That's the part that doesn't have like the hair-like protrusions on the interior of the stomach. Incredible. 37:27 Next, the Gemara says, the next part of the Mishnah, this actually leads us to a fascinating discussion. Drusas ha'eiv. So, if you remember again, I will say, the Mishnah spoke about this idea. The Mishnah, I just want to read to you from the Mishnah. So, the Mishnah said, >> [clears throat] >> "Drusas ha'eiv." If you have an animal, if you have an animal that ultimately again was clawed by a wolf. It was clawed by a wolf. So, ultimately again, 37:51 the Mishnah says that it is a treifah. Rabbi Yehudah, who this I'm just I'm quoting you from the Mishnah. Rabbi Yehudah says, "Drusas ha'eiv bedakah, drusas ha'eiv begasah." Rabbi Yehudah says, ultimately again, if if a small animal was clawed by a wolf, then it's a treifah. A larger animal if it was clawed by a lion. Drusas ha'eiv be'oaf, dakah drusas So, the Gemara said, So, the Mishnah introduces us to this 38:17 idea that halachah l'ma'aseh, if a wolf would claw an animal, the animal the the victim would become a treif. Now, Rashi in the Mishna already explained why, because there was venom on the claws of the wolf. 38:33 Here's the problem. Wolves wolves, lions, birds in general do not have venom on their claws. So, what do you do with this? So, if you notice, I put on the WhatsApp chat, there is a great book. This is not a commercial, it's not product placement. But, it happens to be a great book called Chulin Illuminated. 38:51 Right? Which has a lot of pictures, a lot of pictures. In the back, he also has a fantastic appendix just with a lot of different a lot of different insights. I put out two over here, this so what does he say? So, I just want to quote to you from this. Ah, thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Baruch atah Adonai Eloheinu Melech ha'olam shehakol nihyeh bidvaro. 39:11 So, what does he say? So, interestingly, I'm not going to read it to you, you read it on your own. But, in the Chulin Illuminated, what he has over here essentially is what the Gemara calls venom is not venom. In fact, it's bacteria. Then, what would happen is a lot of a number of animals including a wolf, when it goes ahead and attacks, its claws extend. 39:30 Claws its prey, then the claws retract a little bit. What ended up happening was that meat from its prey would end up settling on the interior of the claws causing a bacterial breeding ground. As a result, then when the animal would then go ahead and claw its next prey, that bacteria that bacteria would then get into its prey. The Gemara calls that venom. But, it's not venom. It's not 39:55 venom, it's actually just bacteria. So again, you'll read this on your own. It's really it's really quite odd. Fine, I'll read it to you. Right? The lethal component of the clawing process most locally known as cat scratch poison, a collection of infectious bacteria that is often present in the claws of preying animals. These animals have claws that retract into small chambers in the foot 40:17 when not in use. Bits of the canine meat often collect in these chambers creating a breeding ground for bacteria. When it attacks, the animal extracts its claws together with some of the infectious material. The wounds produced by the claws are thus immediately infected with potentially fatal results. 40:36 Now, as interesting as it should be noted over that the wolf, a member of the dog family, has claws that do not retract. Okay? In any event, the point over here is what the calls venom is not actually venom, but some type of bacterial infection. Okay, fascinating. So, let's go So, let's get into this now. 40:54 Juda says as if so I'm already with the Amara. The Behema min azeiv similar to the Behema min azeiv ul umala. Both of us may I say now say you know what I'm saying similar to what he said in the Mishnah. In the animal kingdom, right? In the animal world, ultimately again for a Behema and again about say Behema is Behema is generally what we call like a larger size animal. What type of animal? 41:17 What type of animal goes ahead and causes these treif like effects? It's a wolf and larger. So again, the predator the predator the predator animal has to be wolf and larger by Behemas. 41:31 Ul ulfos and by birds mean hanitz ul umala. From the nitz the nitz was a type of bird. A nitz bird and larger. So, the Amara said ut eimai. What are we coming to exclude? This is very interesting. Eilai ut eimai katul. Maybe it's coming to exclude a cat. Right? That if a cat goes ahead and claws a Behema, so that animal ultimately again that animal is 41:55 not a treif. Animal is not a treif. So, the Amara says, "Okay, tanino." Ul Juda says as if Well, that seems to be kind of explicit. Why? Because the Mishnah itself says an animal that is clawed by a wolf. Aiv temal. Hak amash madan d'zeiv b'gasa nami daris. 42:14 Maybe it's coming to teach me. Maybe maybe the condition is like this. Not that a cat can't go ahead and inflict a treifa injury. Maybe it's coming to teach me that even a wolf has the ability to make a behema gasa, a large animal, into a treifa. But no, but we learn that's not true. Who don't agree with this? It says true says bedaka or true says begasa. But that's not true cuz 42:38 in the mishna that what? A zaev, right? The clawing of a wolf can make a small animal, what we call a behema daka, into a treifa. But ultimately again, in order for a behema gasa, a large animal, that requires like a lion, right? A lion has to do that. The Rabbi Yehuda may flip out. Maybe Rabbi Yehuda is arg- arguing with the tana kama. 42:59 But Rabbi Yanya bar Yafes Rabbi Elai lo ba Rabbi Yehuda farish derech hachamim. Rabbi Yehuda is not coming to argue. Rabbi Yehuda is coming to explain, right? So when the tana kama comes along and says that if a wolf claws an animal, it makes that animal into a treifa, Rabbi Yehuda says, "Okay, what are we talking about? 43:18 A wolf has the ability to make a small animal, a behema daka, into a treifa. But only a lion has the and bigger has the ability to make a behema gasa, a larger animal, into a treifa." To which the Gemara says, "Gavara gavaram is so what are you doing? You're Maybe not Maybe it's just different opinions. 43:36 Maybe there's one opinion that says that Rabbi Yehuda is coming to modify or it's not to explain the position of the hachamim. Whereas the second opinion says, "No, Rabbi Yehuda is coming to argue." You know what it says? "One mental machlokes." E by seima. The other possibility is the olam lemiutcha to. No, maybe when the mishna comes along and says that if a wolf claws an animal, the mishna is literally 43:59 coming along to exclude a cat. That if a cat claws an animal, it cannot make it into a treifa. What would you have thought? Rather than what would I have thought? Or rather than what I would have thought I would have thought like this, maybe when the missioner says wolf, wolf is not meant to be explicit, but rather again what is wolf? Wolf is just a common example. But wolf is not coming to exclude anything. In other words, 44:22 that even if a even if a cat would claw an animal, perhaps even a cat's clawing would go ahead and make the animal into a treif. Come on actually that wolf is specific. Wolf is specific that the wolf to the exclusion ultimately again of a cat. 44:46 If a if a if a cat goes ahead and claws an animal, and a mia and a mia and again the mia the mia will say is also another small type of animal. Big deal or but slime. So interesting enough I would say interestingly enough that if you have a cat sorry cat or a mia now again I would say this is another opinion. This is Amram and then brother Kista that if a cat or a mia go 45:10 ahead and claw the entire what are you going to do with the lime? This is a small a small lamb, right? Or a small goat. These are smaller animals. So again the mara says or or it's lime again that then so again in this in this model cat clawing will have a treif impact on another small animal. Similarly again 45:35 choose us who that the office if a weasel goes ahead and claws if a weasel goes ahead and claws a bird ultimately again that will also go ahead and make it into a treif. So you know what I'm saying so now the same thing with the guest cuz what the missioner seemed to be saying was like this really the only animal the smallest animal that could inflict treif like impact through its 45:59 clawing is a wolf. Is a wolf right? Smaller than that, namely a cat, will not go ahead and make it into a treif animal. Now, the Gemara quotes in the opinion of Rashi that no, even the clawing of a cat could work by smaller animals. A small sheep, a small goat. 46:15 Just like a whole the weasel could impact or could go ahead and inflict treif like clawing on birds. So, the Gemara says, "Trei meisa is a kasha." True says "Chatul neits on a meya." So, the Gemara says "Alacha l'maaseh." So, the Gemara says as we're going to see what they're going to do. We're going to stop over here for today. I apologize I have to just end a few minutes early. 46:34 We'll stop over here for today. We'll pick up a marsha shana. I'll leave you on a cliffhanger. A cliffhanger, right? Does a cat make it a Does a cat make it a Yeah, all right. All right. I'll stop over here. I'm sorry for today. We'll We'll pick up So, Rashi says again, "What What What are we leaving off?" Essentially, we'll say "Shh. Just give me Give me Give me Give me Give Give me 30 seconds. 30 seconds, right? So, remember. So, before It's 46:58 like just when the teacher says This is the mistake I made. I said class is over before the bell rang. And you say class is over before the bell rang. That's it. That's what happens. So, just just to frame what we're My bad. Just to frame what we left off with, right? The Mishnah All the Mishnah tells me is that "Alacha l'maaseh Alacha l'maaseh that the clawing of a wolf makes the animal into a treif animal." That That's what I know. Then Rabbi Yehudah comes along and 47:21 says, "Ultimately, again, a wolf by beheima daka, but let's say a lion by beheima gasa." So, the fundamental machlokes is Is Rabbi Yehudah modifying the statement of the Tanna Kamma or is he arguing with the statement of the Tanna Kamma? What that opens up to in general is Is wolf the smallest animal which could inflict treif clawing or is it possible 47:44 even for a smaller animal, for example, a cat to inflict treif clawing? That's our fundamental shaila that we still have to deal with. So, we'll say So, that So, now the Gemara quoted ultimately again the statement of the statement of Rav Chisda, who seemed to indicate that even a cat can inflict treifa like clawing. That seems to be what he said. Whether or not that's 48:08 halacha l'maaseh or result of the tomorrow of say shkoyach. Incredible. Incredible. All right, have a blessed moment and have a great day, everyone.
Expand transcript 8,991 words
